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  #1 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: May 24th, 2004
Posts: 38
gnome2 is flying high
Default no download from shareazaa

using phex g1 protocol . (linux version)

coming from edonkey netwerk , wel still on and share my files to gnutella netwerk ,iam used to share !

why is shareazaa downloading from me ! If i cannot download from them !

i was used to the situation that all my connections to shareaza fail , and all my uploads they asked are ignored , have no problem with that .

but since today they are downing from me , and i still cannot download from them ,.

so because this is not fair , iam wondering what happens or what changes that this is happening ?

at the moment i ban the shareazaa clients by IP , and let limewire and bearshare clients download from me , because i always can download from them .....but this is not an "great" situation , and i dont like it either .

anybody have some answers for me ?

thanks .
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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Salut Gnome2, please say gnutella for G1. G1 is a shareaza invention to better market it's G2. First I'm in the same situation as you (as thousands of others using gnet). I have two LW on the home network and I compiled the one uploading the most to ban shareaza clients. They are not 100% leechers, but they take way too much compare to what they give. It is because Shareaza is a multinetwork P2P. It divides it's upload bandwidth between Gnutella, G2, ED2K and Bittorrent. For exemple, if you have 128kb upload bandwidth on Phex: you can upload 128kb on gnet minus the overhaed of connecting to one network. On Shareaza, if you enable all networks, that 128kbs is divided in 4 (32kb) minus the overhad for each protocol. Yes it sucks. That's why I hate multinetwork clients. On the defense of RAZA, they do share interesting content instead of Morpheus that does not share one bit of bandwidth with us.

Sad
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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Join Date: May 24th, 2004
Posts: 38
gnome2 is flying high
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Peerless
multi-network client = Leech
not al the time if you play the game fair .

an bittorrent plugin for a program as edonkey is good , torrents will stay longer alive . it depends on the user .

iam intrested in a filter that check for me the files of an other user . lets say video files and the count of mb shared of those video .

i give upload away if an minimal of 6 gig is on the hdd of the other client , all video files .

good filter and verry good for gnutella network .

i wish i have that :-)
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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The only way for a multi net client to play fair is to implement DL:UP ratio for each protocol. Shareaza does it for Bittorrent and ED2K I believe, but not for Gnutella. Morpheus doesn't have any DL:UP ratio. In those conditions, they hurt the Gnet. Many individuals using Shareaza could say that they upload more than they dl from Gnutella, but as a whole (all shareaza together), they are teasing us with their files that are hard to download.

Ciao
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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wel they must upload to ed2k and bt-network

if not to ed2k , they will get no sources and upload
if not to BT - they will not able to use the torrents after some time , because sites wil record how much they seed . if you have not a ratio of 1:1 you will be gone and lost .

well thay are banned anyway...................
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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Yeah I know about the BT and ED2K ratios... They explain why Shareaza threats its Gnutella support as a third class priority as shows the 2.1 release with not ONE improvement or bugfix related to gnutella.

Ciao
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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why is such an ratio never implemented with gnutella ?

are there any future plans for ?
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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Because Gnutella is a Kazaa type network where everyone (newbies) is welcomed. BT and ED2K networks are a bit ellitic in the way that they require users to be quite advanced at the network levels (high IDs, port configuration). If LW or Bearshare would limit download by amount of uploads, much of the network would dl nothing (thus leaving). 70% of the gnutellanetwork is firewalled and thus provide much less upload opportunities. (That should change in LW 4.2 with firewall to firewall transfers). Also a credit system à la eMule is problematic as far as implementation accross clients is concerned (Gnutella has the biggest variety of different clients). Better just lobby in shareaza forums to either stop using gnutella or start being fair, like trap_jaw is doing over there. I personnally think they should drop gnutella support (as well as ED2K...). The problem with shareaza is that it is hard to convince their supporters as they are a LOT (in active fans) supporting the multinetwork idea.

For now I prefer lobby against Morpheus, it is less time consuming and more benefical, IMO
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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I can't share the opinion of Shareaza being leeching the Gnutella network. First, leecher do exist, that's no secret, but leechers are far less a problem that for example people that don't configure their firewall or router properly. I think firewalled clients are a much bigger problem.

Shareaza cannot leech Gnutella more than G2, because the upload queues in Shareaza are not configurable to differ between Gnutella or G2 uploads. They're both HTTP transfers, which are treated in the exact same way. However, the user may choose to disable Gnutella and to forbid (which doesn't happen by default) any upload to not connected networks, in this case Gnutella. But then it won't download from Gnutella either. Unfortunately, such clients may still appear in Gnutella's alternate source mesh, and get into the list of sources of a Gnutella client. This fools people into thinking that Shareaza doesn't want to upload to them, thus is leeching. But this is not true, it only disallows uploads, because Gnutella has been disabled on that client.

Shareaza clients can be downloaded from without problems, but it happens that people don't properly configure their firewall or router, which may make it impossible for Gnutella users to download from those clients. A push request is required for this and if the user doesn't have Gnutella enabled, then this push request will only be possible over G2.

Also it's worth mentioning that many people don't use all of Shareaza's network at the same time. Many people (including me) use it exclusively with G2.

Last but not least, it's unfortunately true that Shareaza's support for Gnutella is outdated. This is being worked on.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old October 3rd, 2004
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Quote:
I can't share the opinion of Shareaza being leeching the Gnutella network. First, leecher do exist, that's no secret, but leechers are far less a problem that for example people that don't configure their firewall or router properly. I think firewalled clients are a much bigger problem.
Firewalls are definitly a problem, but being unfirewalled I know that when I click download from a LW source, it will begin to download shortly because of push proxies and that LW doesn't send query hits when it has an upload queue -meaning a result is downloadable as of now-. This can't be said of a shareaza source.

Quote:
Shareaza cannot leech Gnutella more than G2, because the upload queues in Shareaza are not configurable to differ between Gnutella or G2 uploads
Fair. But users using G2 and gnutella on shareaza are getting downloads from two network, while users on gnutella only get a half of your upload bandwidth.

Quote:
Also it's worth mentioning that many people don't use all of Shareaza's network at the same time. Many people (including me) use it exclusively with G2.
It should only be that way. It should be worth mentionning than the vast majority of shareaza users are using multinetworks simultaneously.

Quote:
Last but not least, it's unfortunately true that Shareaza's support for Gnutella is outdated. This is being worked on.
I'm reading the shareaza's dev forums. Point me to a thread because it is simply not true. Only talk for now, as Mike himself doesn't feel Gnutella support is outdated.

I love the content you share but I would like to get it while you don't eat all my upload bandwidth. Usually, a source downloading from shareaza = 1-2KB/s which is way too low for a Gnutella source. Acceptable in ED2K world only.

Sorry but I can't understand the goal of a multinet app, except to get more popular at first. Shareaza has now more than 100 000 simultaneous users online, it can survive without my files and my bandwidth. Ares started at 1 000 simultaneous users early 2003. It now reaches 800 000 users simultaneous without being multinetwork.

Ciao
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