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LeeWare November 17th, 2002 12:28 PM

Maximizing upload/download Success LimeWire
 
I posted this thread in the open discussion but decided I should also post it here as it could be useful for some people.

Maximizing upload/download Success LimeWire

Objective:

I'm starting this thread to address two common problems which seem to appear over and over again in the forums.

General description of the problem:

1. Problems downloading content
2. Low upload count


With the influx of users to peer to peer networking and specifically New LimeWire users many of which I assume are also new broadband users there are several issues that arise out of a general lack of knowledge in what is required to participate in this type of networking model with moderate success. There are a few things that become self evident if you've spent any time on the Gnutella network and these forums.

1. Posts to the forum that don't adequately describe the problem. (for example, I can't connect.) -

The status of these problems would have a higher probability of receiving useful feedback if users provided some basic information such as; machine, operating system, connection speed, location of connection I.E. School work or home.

For example: I'm new to Limewire- I just downloaded limewire and installed it on a Windows 98 Machine with a T1 connection to the network from school. I don't have a firewall installed on my computer and don't know if there is one here but I cannot seem to connect using limewire. My other application i'e web browsers and email work fine. Can anybody tell me what's wrong?


2. Posts to the forum for issues that have been addressed in the FAQs suggests that people are not reading them.

3. Posts to forum for issues that have been addressed in other threads this also suggests that people are not even reading the threads before they post.
4. Post to areas of the forum that are not necessarily dedicated to the issues being raised. Connection Problems in the Open Discussion Forum. MAC issues in the Open Forum.

5. Finally, posts to the forum that have nothing to do with file sharing.


Now, for the problems people are having with uploading / downloading, Consider the following suggestions:


To maximize your ability to download successfully do the following things:

1. Go to tools/options/searching/Quality (show all four star results)

This will effectively filter out all of the people who are behind firewalls or have other connection issues, this will greatly reduce your frustration in downloading.

I should note however, that this could significantly reduce the amount of content you see, as most of the content being shared on the network is being shared from hosts which are poorly configured for sharing and you would probably have problems downloading from them anyway.


2. Go to tools/options/searching/speed (show all speeds)

I make this suggestion because if you are already filtering by Quality, filtering by speed will further reduce your results. If there 20 people on modem connections that have the content you want why not download from them.

3. Go to tools/options/filters/hosts under the disallow all messages from specific hosts add the following IPs: 192.168.*.* AND 10.*.*.*

I make this suggestion to filter out all the host who have incorrectly forwarded their private IP address on the network. These IP addresses are NOT routable and you will NOT be able to connect and download content from these hosts so ignore results from these guys. if

4. Go to tools/options/filters/keywords Filter out search results containing !!!

Most likely viruses or porn files emulating your search queries.


Now on to problems with uploading. If you are experiencing problems with people up loading from your computer the suggestions I made in and maximizing your ability to download see:( 1 through 4 above.) your machine could be one of these hosts.

I'll start with some general suggestions:

1. Make sure that you are not sharing from a work or school location as peer to peer traffic tends to be administratively prohibited. although it may not be explicitly blocked they could be applying quality of service rules to your traffic.

2. If you are sharing from home - leave your machine on for at least 4 hours (you can't expect people to download from you if you jump on the network do some searches and then disconnect.)

3. Finally, if you are using NAT (meaning that the IP address of your machine is 10.x.x.x or 192.x.x.x ) now, might be able to connect, search and download from the network but no one will be able to upload from you. If you have taken the advise of others to force your IP using limewire then your half way there, as your port forwarding is working correctly. But, you need to FORCE THE IP OF YOUR ROUTER or FIREWALL to the network. To find out what your ip is from the machine that you use to get on Gnutella open a web browser to http://www.whatismyip.com
(write this IP down and force this IP in Limewire) If you need help testing this Just post a reply to this thread.

By implementing these suggestions you will have better luck downloading and uploading on Gnutella.

Julie Z November 17th, 2002 04:18 PM

LeeWare:

You're AWESOME !!!!

Can we make this a stickie on all of the LimeWire Forums? And then make it so that no one can post until it's read? ;) :D ;)

I know this is a place to ask for help, and not everyone is aware of the best way to do that, but it has been extremely frustrating lately with so many new threads being started with the same problem.

What's more frustrating is when someone posts a solution yet people continue the thread saying: "I have the same problem". Completely ignoring the fact that someone answered the question.

Ahhhhhh...just wanted to vent a little...:D

LeeWare November 18th, 2002 08:19 AM

Julie, Thanks for your support!

Julie Z November 18th, 2002 09:15 AM

You're very welcome.

And, THANK YOU!!! for all of your discussions and knowledge in these forums.

:cool:

rutro November 18th, 2002 09:55 AM

I second that!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Julie Z
And, THANK YOU!!! for all of your discussions and knowledge in these forums.
Yes... Your detailed, helpful participation is much appreciated. Thanks LeeWare! :)

Unregistered November 25th, 2002 07:42 PM

test
 
twst

LeeWare November 26th, 2002 07:05 AM

?

fryer69 November 30th, 2002 11:38 AM

Thanks for the advice it has helped a great deal :)
although i still cant download warcraft3 :( from anyone although there are 50+ in one section i still get requery sent waiting for results any suggestions
cheers for the help without ppl like u us us users would be dead in the water
trhx again fryer

donnamb November 30th, 2002 11:55 AM

ip test please?
 
I would like to test my IP address as mentioned above. I have uploaded quite a few files since I first logged into Gnutella last night, but they cannot be found in a search. I use a Mac at home with a broadband connection and limewire 2.7.13. I believe I have enabled the ip to be forced and followed all other suggestions for uploading and downloading. Still, I am concerned my files are not available to others.

Thank you,

Donna

trap_jaw November 30th, 2002 12:30 PM

Re: Maximizing upload/download Success LimeWire
 
Quote:

Originally posted by LeeWare
To maximize your ability to download successfully do the following things:

1. Go to tools/options/searching/Quality (show all four star results)

This will effectively filter out all of the people who are behind firewalls or have other connection issues, this will greatly reduce your frustration in downloading.

In addition it will reduce the number of four-star results left over for people who are behind firewalls and who are depending on those four-star results (while non-firewalled users can easily download from 3-star results). Furthermore if a search for rare content returns you only 1-star results you will see no results at all, although there is a good chance you could be queued in the 1-star hosts upload-queue or that the 1-star host could tell you who else might have that file.

Quote:

3. Go to tools/options/filters/hosts under the disallow all messages from specific hosts add the following IPs: 192.168.*.* AND 10.*.*.*
Not a good idea either. While firewalled users could never download from the hosts you block, a normal user could with a little luck. Apart from that you are effectively blocking ALL firewalled users who don't know how to force their IP address from Gnutella.

Quote:

I make this suggestion to filter out all the host who have incorrectly forwarded their private IP address on the network. These IP addresses are NOT routable and you will NOT be able to connect and download content from these hosts so ignore results from these guys.
That's wrong. LimeWire will not try to connect to them directly. It will broadcast a PUSH request so those firewalled hosts will make a connection to you, offering the file you wanted.

Quote:

[B]4. Go to tools/options/filters/keywords Filter out search results containing !!!

Most likely viruses or porn files emulating your search queries.[B]
And don't forget to filter "/" while you're at it, since this character causes 90% of all CouldNotMoveToLibrary errors.

Quote:

1. Make sure that you are not sharing from a work or school location as peer to peer traffic tends to be administratively prohibited. although it may not be explicitly blocked they could be applying quality of service rules to your traffic.
That means you cannot share with 100% of the bandwidth, so what? Most of the time you will not be able to connect to Gnutella at all, - and if you can connect to Gnutella you can probably share, too.

Quote:

3. Finally, if you are using NAT (meaning that the IP address of your machine is 10.x.x.x or 192.x.x.x ) now, might be able to connect, search and download from the network but no one will be able to upload from you.
See above.

LeeWare November 30th, 2002 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fryer69
Thanks for the advice it has helped a great deal :)
although i still cant download warcraft3 :( from anyone although there are 50+ in one section i still get requery sent waiting for results any suggestions
cheers for the help without ppl like u us us users would be dead in the water
trhx again fryer

Thanks--I'm glad the information was useful to you.

LeeWare November 30th, 2002 02:43 PM

Re: ip test please?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by donnamb
I would like to test my IP address as mentioned above. I have uploaded quite a few files since I first logged into Gnutella last night, but they cannot be found in a search. I use a Mac at home with a broadband connection and limewire 2.7.13. I believe I have enabled the ip to be forced and followed all other suggestions for uploading and downloading. Still, I am concerned my files are not available to others.

Thank you,

Donna




Check your library tab in limewire under the uploads column x/y
where x is a successful upload and y is an attempted upload. If you see values for x then everything is working okay. If you see values in y then that means that an attempt was made but may have been aborted for some reason usually at the remote users request.

As for you not finding the files you have uploaded. Please keep in mind that because someone uploaded files from you doesn't mean that they will share them. Also it is a high likelyhood that if they are sharing the files they are outside of your search horizon or, you are filtering the results coming from those hosts by applying the techniques discussed in my first post.


Please let us know how it goes.


Hope this helps.

LeeWare November 30th, 2002 04:02 PM

Regarding Comments from Trap_Jaw
 
Trap_Jaw says....

"In addition it will reduce the number of four-star results left over for people who are behind firewalls and who are depending on those four-star results (while non-firewalled users can easily download from 3-star results). Furthermore if a search for rare content returns you only 1-star results you will see no results at all, although there is a good chance you could be queued in the 1-star hosts upload-queue or that the 1-star host could tell you who else might have that file."


This is true and possible-however the subject of my post was "Maximizing Upload/Download Success." The intended audiance are those people who join the gnutella network and try for hours to download things unsuccessfully. This solution offers them immediate gratification.

So as I'm sure you have seen this has helped more people than you can image. I have received very few complaints about using these methods. So, I'm not sure I understand where your going with your comments.



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3. Go to tools/options/filters/hosts under the disallow all messages from specific hosts add the following IPs: 192.168.*.* AND 10.*.*.*
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Trap_Jaw says....

"Not a good idea either. While firewalled users could never download from the hosts you block, a normal user ((could with a little luck.)) Apart from that you are effectively blocking ALL firewalled users who don't know how to force their IP address from Gnutella."

Luck is one thing. The purpose of my post is to provide users with a since of satisfaction. Again, I've received very few complaints about the methodologies I've outline. I should add however any user experienced enough to use this service with any success doesn't need this information. However for people you just like to jump on the computer and actually accomplish download something this information is very valuable to them. Yes - I am suggesting that people block all of the people who don't now how to force IPs for use on Gnutella. (This is part of the problem - these users cause tremendous amounts of frustration for other users. I assume, and it appears correctly, that they will figure it out when sharing lots of files with lots of hits an no uploads that something is wrong.) This thread was started to help them solve this problem. So, in my personal opinion I think it is a good idea.




quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I make this suggestion to filter out all the host who have incorrectly forwarded their private IP address on the network. These IP addresses are NOT routable and you will NOT be able to connect and download content from these hosts so ignore results from these guys.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Trap_Jaw says....

"That's wrong. LimeWire will not try to connect to them directly. It will broadcast a PUSH request so those firewalled hosts will make a connection to you, offering the file you wanted."

I think we are confusing Firewalled and NATed host issues. When you force the right IP on the network the PUSH requests work correctly. If you don't, this is what happens.


#1 Ping/Query Messages travel from Host to Host looking for content until the ttl has expired
#2 Pong/Responses Recurse the Query path to find the the host that issued the query. If my machine is a NATed machine it will respond with the ip of my private net. (192.168.*.* or 10.*.*.*) I would not be able to DOWNLOAD or send a PUSH request to this IP address. As the mechanism for doing file tranfers don't take place within the Gnutella network but between the two hosts i.e. the one issuing the query and the one responding to the query.

Trap_Jaw says....

"And don't forget to filter "/" while you're at it, since this character causes 90% of all CouldNotMoveToLibrary errors."

This was a good call as it is a problem experienced by many users.



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[B]1. Make sure that you are not sharing from a work or school location as peer to peer traffic tends to be administratively prohibited. although it may not be explicitly blocked they could be applying quality of service rules to your traffic.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Trap_Jaw says....

"That means you cannot share with 100% of the bandwidth, so what? Most of the time you will not be able to connect to Gnutella at all, - and if you can connect to Gnutella you can probably share, too."

The reason I mention this is because in the cases where QoS is applied to P2P traffic the polocies tend to be strick which means that almost no-bandwidth is allocated to P2P traffic. So for instance anyone downloading or uploading on these connection can expect serious problems with the files tranfers. Take for instance a QoS polocies that says allow 4Kbps to P2P traffic means:

MP3 Size * BitRate = SizeInBit / QoSBitRateAllows = SecondsToDownload / MinutesToDownload = Download Time.


So, to download or upload a 4MB MP3 file with this QoS policy would take 2.2 Hrs to download/upload (So What?)
Limewire would report this as 0.5KB.

I Personally don't think that people with faster connection like waiting that long for a single file.

Hope this helps to clarify my position.

trap_jaw November 30th, 2002 05:13 PM

Re: Regarding Comments from Trap_Jaw
 
Quote:

"Not a good idea either. While firewalled users could never download from the hosts you block, a normal user ((could with a little luck.)) Apart from that you are effectively blocking ALL firewalled users who don't know how to force their IP address from Gnutella."

Luck is one thing. The purpose of my post is to provide users with a since of satisfaction.
A significant number of users has no direct connection to the internet, - and you are trying to help some users (with good connections who don't really need that help) while hurting others (who already have a lower QoS because they're firewalled). I don't even think you are effectively helping anyone, since you are telling people with good connections to ignore a good number of hosts they could actually download from.

Quote:

Again, I've received very few complaints about the methodologies I've outline.
That does not suprise me. Some users will see a better ratio of search results to working downloads. That's not because you helped them increase the number of working downloads but reduce the number of overall results (also ignoring results that might have worked without problems).

Quote:

Yes - I am suggesting that people block all of the people who don't now how to force IPs for use on Gnutella.
Forcing your IP address does not work in any case: You will need a router that supports port-forwarding and it has to be properly configured, too. Otherwise people will connect to your router (since you forced its IP address) and the router will simply discard those connection attempts because it doesn't know what to do with it. In some cases you will have to ask the admin of your network to set up port-forwarding for you, for example, - and that's not good if you are using Gnutella at a university or at school.
That's what PUSH was invented for. It works even when your IP is not forced.

Quote:

I think we are confusing Firewalled and NATed host issues. When you force the right IP on the network the PUSH requests work correctly. If you don't, this is what happens.


#1 Ping/Query Messages travel from Host to Host looking for content until the ttl has expired
#2 Pong/Responses Recurse the Query path to find the the host that issued the query. If my machine is a NATed machine it will respond with the ip of my private net. (192.168.*.* or 10.*.*.*) I would not be able to DOWNLOAD or send a PUSH request to this IP address.
You clearly didn't understand how PUSH works. - The PUSH message will recurse the path of the response and will reach the firewalled host through the peers that transmitted the queryhit to you. If you got a queryhit from a firewalled host and you are accepting incoming connections, you will be able to download from it. Forcing your IP address makes your NAT transparent, so you can accept incoming connections and you won't appear to be firewalled to anyone else on the network.

Quote:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Make sure that you are not sharing from a work or school location as peer to peer traffic tends to be administratively prohibited. although it may not be explicitly blocked they could be applying quality of service rules to your traffic.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Trap_Jaw says....

"That means you cannot share with 100% of the bandwidth, so what? Most of the time you will not be able to connect to Gnutella at all, - and if you can connect to Gnutella you can probably share, too."

The reason I mention this is because in the cases where QoS is applied to P2P traffic the polocies tend to be strick which means that almost no-bandwidth is allocated to P2P traffic. So for instance anyone downloading or uploading on these connection can expect serious problems with the files tranfers. Take for instance a QoS polocies that says allow 4Kbps to P2P traffic means:

MP3 Size * BitRate = SizeInBit / QoSBitRateAllows = SecondsToDownload / MinutesToDownload = Download Time.


So, to download or upload a 4MB MP3 file with this QoS policy would take 2.2 Hrs to download/upload (So What?)
Limewire would report this as 0.5KB.
That's what swarming is for - and I have no problem with waiting 2.2 hours, - it's better than if those people weren't sharing at all. Besides, I don't think you have any numbers on how many networks are effectively applying those policies. - You might very well be telling a lot of people to stop sharing files although their connection is perfectly alright.

LeeWare November 30th, 2002 07:26 PM

Re: Re: Regarding Comments from Trap_Jaw
 
Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
A significant number of users has no direct connection to the internet, - and you are trying to help some users (with good connections who don't really need that help) while hurting others (who already have a lower QoS because they're firewalled). I don't even think you are effectively helping anyone, since you are telling people with good connections to ignore a good number of hosts they could actually download from.
Personally I don't think being behind a firewall is such a big deal. In fact the program works find with most firewall implementations. Thus many of those people are able to participate without much issue. The people who have the most failure are the ones with firewall / NAT implementations that are configured correctly. There at least 4 different types of NAT implementations and anyone with a remote understanding of NAT knows that there are some problem with using NATed based hosts with certain Internet Applications.


Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
That does not suprise me. Some users will see a better ratio of search results to working downloads. That's not because you helped them increase the number of working downloads but reduce the number of overall results (also ignoring results that might have worked without problems).

It is also noted in my original post that by taking these measures one would see significantly less results. My intention being why do a search that returns a large amounts of results and only a few, will after much attempting will actually work. Come-on, You've been on the forum you know that this is a problem.

Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
Forcing your IP address does not work in any case: You will need a router that supports port-forwarding and it has to be properly configured, too. Otherwise people will connect to your router (since you forced its IP address) and the router will simply discard those connection attempts because it doesn't know what to do with it. In some cases you will have to ask the admin of your network to set up port-forwarding for you, for example, - and that's not good if you are using Gnutella at a university or at school.
That's what PUSH was invented for. It works even when your IP is not forced.

You just described a typical situation involving a standard firewall which is usually not a NAT based implementation.


Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
You clearly didn't understand how PUSH works. - The PUSH message will recurse the path of the response and will reach the firewalled host through the peers that transmitted the queryhit to you. If you got a queryhit from a firewalled host and you are accepting incoming connections, you will be able to download from it. Forcing your IP address makes your NAT transparent, so you can accept incoming connections and you won't appear to be firewalled to anyone else on the network.
You clearly didn't read my post before replying. (I think we are confusing Firewalled and NATed host issues. When you force the right IP on the network the PUSH requests work correctly.)

Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
That's what swarming is for - and I have no problem with waiting 2.2 hours, - it's better than if those people weren't sharing at all. Besides, I don't think you have any numbers on how many networks are effectively applying those policies. - You might very well be telling a lot of people to stop sharing files although their connection is perfectly alright.
Quote:

Originally posted by trap_jaw
In some cases you will have to ask the admin of your network to set up port-forwarding for you, for example, - and that's not good if you are using Gnutella at a university or at school.
I think it's a safe bet to assume that high percentage of sudden problems uploading/downloading from a school or work location and I'll even go as far as saying from some ISPs is a problem. For example any one large school or University that decides to crack down on p2p use could affect upwards to 1,200 users with the implementation of a Qos Policy and this is assuming approximately 1% p2p use.

trap_jaw December 1st, 2002 01:31 AM

Re: Re: Re: Regarding Comments from Trap_Jaw
 
Quote:

Personally I don't think being behind a firewall is such a big deal. In fact the program works find with most firewall implementations. Thus many of those people are able to participate without much issue.
You are talking about personal firewalls, here. The term 'firewall' also applies for routers which can serve e.g. as a proxy between the internet and a LAN.

Quote:

There at least 4 different types of NAT implementations and anyone with a remote understanding of NAT knows that there are some problem with using NATed based hosts with certain Internet Applications.
The problem with node behind a router is that it won't accept incoming packets without setting up port forwarding. NAT means "Network Address Translation" (same as IP Masquerading for *n*x users). On a LAN you would be sending packets meant for some host outside you LAN to your router. Your router will disassemble that packet and exchange your local IP address for the router IP address on the internet. However, if the router receives a packet from the internet, it does not know where to send it on the LAN, unless you set up the router to forward all incoming packets e.g. with a certain destination port to you. If you are using a router without NAT, you will not be able connect to gnutella.

Quote:

You just described a typical situation involving a standard firewall which is usually not a NAT based implementation.
Come on, don't act like you knew what NAT is.

Quote:

You clearly didn't read my post before replying. (I think we are confusing Firewalled and NATed host issues. When you force the right IP on the network the PUSH requests work correctly.)
PUSH REQUEST ALSO WORK WHEN THE CORRECT IP IS NOT FORCED! I DID READ YOUR POST AND YOU SIMPLY DON'T GET HOW PUSH WORKS!

Quote:

I think it's a safe bet to assume that high percentage of sudden problems uploading/downloading from a school or work location and I'll even go as far as saying from some ISPs is a problem.
It's not a safe bet. The vast majority of really fast connections (T1, T3+) are from schools, universities and from work locations. Blocking them is just stupid.

I don't think this discussion is leading anywhere. If you don't believe me that your "advice" doesn't improve anything it's okay with me - I mean you are LeeWare, you're helping people, you're the master of the universe - but still you don't have a clue about the way the gnutella network or the internet in general works. So please, don't try to explain them to others.

LeeWare December 1st, 2002 09:09 AM

We're Waiting .....
 
Trap_jaw....


Since it appears that you have superior knowlege of the various facets of technology and how they work together. I am looking forward to YOU posting a thread that adequately addresses the concerns raised on the forum.

I'm sure everyone here would welcome your input as it would be more helpful than your technical analysis of the methologies I've posted.

Please save us from our own stupidity.

It your show and I realize you can't help it. You'll just have to say something.

lizardflix December 4th, 2002 05:51 PM

Upload problems
 
I have really tried everything suggested that I can understand and still seem to be unable to share files. I show a number of files as being shared at the bottom of my limewire window but when I go to the library tab, although I show plenty of hits, my upload column is all 0s.

I am on a Mac OSX using a router on a cable connection.

I've done the force IP address as suggested as well.

Is there something that I am missing?

Excuse my ignorance but I don't want to be a freeloader.

Thanks
bb

trap_jaw December 4th, 2002 06:27 PM

The force IP thingy does not work unless you set up port-forwarding (if you don't know how to do that - you might as well leave the force IP stuff out). -

If LimeWire says that it is sharing files and if you are able to download files from other hosts it is also possible for others to access your files as long as they are not behind a router, too.

LeeWare December 6th, 2002 07:16 AM

Re: Upload problems
 
Quote:

Originally posted by lizardflix
I have really tried everything suggested that I can understand and still seem to be unable to share files. I show a number of files as being shared at the bottom of my limewire window but when I go to the library tab, although I show plenty of hits, my upload column is all 0s.

I am on a Mac OSX using a router on a cable connection.

I've done the force IP address as suggested as well.

Is there something that I am missing?

Excuse my ignorance but I don't want to be a freeloader.

Thanks
bb

Please see the following thread for more information

http://www.gnutellaforums.com/showth...threadid=17840

pokpok December 27th, 2002 10:05 AM

the reality
 
All of this back and forth between Lee and Trap is a grand showcase of your knowledge of the peer to peer system but isn't it true that Limewire just sucks?

Even optimised using the methods outlined by Lee, Limewire consistently offers "requery sent" and "waiting in line" blah blah blah.........

LeeWare December 30th, 2002 03:40 PM

Re: the reality
 
Quote:

Originally posted by pokpok
All of this back and forth between Lee and Trap is a grand showcase of your knowledge of the peer to peer system but isn't it true that Limewire just sucks?

Even optimised using the methods outlined by Lee, Limewire consistently offers "requery sent" and "waiting in line" blah blah blah.........

I think that I have offered time-an-time again in different threads that many of the problems facing p2p networking systems are not necessarily the results of the clients used to access these networks but of the behavior of the individuals participating in these networking systems.

It's the user base :

#1 People get on the network and jump off.

(24x7 sharers make up about 1% of any p2p system. These sharers have a small percentage of the files sought after on these networks.)

#2 Not enough replication of content.

(see problem #1 - there are not enough reliable sources for content on these networks.)

That's not a limewire problem. So in essence I don't agree that "LimeWire Sucks" It was an excellent p2p application. I personally no-longer use it as I have found a product that more closely suits my needs.

Try not to forget that the success of p2p system by-in-large requires the participation of a large-group of anonymous users, this make coordination and cooperation difficult.

One of the things I've done on the forums and on the p2p system I now use--I've created a content replication group. The purpose of such a group is to band together that group of hard-core file sharers to replicate content first between themselves so that high-demand files are available from a base set of sources. Next more people are invited to join in this effort. Now a much higher rate of of success is achieved from the people who are looking for files hosted by this group. The promise of p2p is also realized even if only in a small way-- the same thing is possible here.

pokpok December 30th, 2002 04:54 PM

how do you splain??
 
Mr. Lee,

How do you explain that Limewire achieves maybe 10-15% successful downloads when a PC running Kazaa sitting on the same desk, at the same time, searching the same Gnutella network, consisting of the same users might successfully find and download at rate of maybe 70%. If you have the setup available, try it before you respond to this post. I will be surprised if your position of "different users, etc" holds water after that experience.......

To be fair I am guesstimating these numbers. Actual stats may be different.

Pokpok

kathyathome January 2nd, 2003 05:55 PM

port forwarding
 
Excuse my ignorance, but where in the Limewire interface does one go to "push" the IP address. I am downloading successfully but not having anyone uploads, and I assume it is because of my router and my Windows XP Home firewall. When I used Shareaza there was a place in the tools menu under connection options to enter the numbers. For instance, I had to tell Shareaza what my router's IP address was and what port to use for inbound requests. I told my firewall to allow that same address and port through. I forwarded that port through my router to my own computer (one of three in our home netword) and had many uploads right away. Where do I tell my Limewire software these things? Is it because I'm using the free version? :confused:

LeeWare January 3rd, 2003 02:22 PM

Re: how do you splain??
 
Quote:

Originally posted by pokpok
Mr. Lee,

How do you explain that Limewire achieves maybe 10-15% successful downloads when a PC running Kazaa sitting on the same desk, at the same time, searching the same Gnutella network, consisting of the same users might successfully find and download at rate of maybe 70%. If you have the setup available, try it before you respond to this post. I will be surprised if your position of "different users, etc" holds water after that experience.......

To be fair I am guesstimating these numbers. Actual stats may be different.

Pokpok

Think network segmentation, think connection preferences etc. although theoretically, and sometimes practically, the gnutella network acts as a big cloud in which each of the various p2p clients connect. Some vendors (I won't mention any names) engineered features and functions which caused problems on the network. As a result, others built their systems (Supernodes / LeafNodes) so that they work together using features x/y all of this brings us to our current situation the network now exists as little separate islands of p2p applications aggregated by their respective Ultrapeers, Super-nodes, or whatever you wish to call them. Communications between these different client bases many times occurrs as a result of the client types connected to a Supernode. don't forget things like search horizons etc.

I think that you can answer your own question if you think about it long enough. Now if you have some specific information that contradicts my comments please do share them.


Hope this helps.

LeeWare January 3rd, 2003 02:32 PM

Re: port forwarding
 
Quote:

Originally posted by kathyathome
Excuse my ignorance, but where in the Limewire interface does one go to "push" the IP address. I am downloading successfully but not having anyone uploads, and I assume it is because of my router and my Windows XP Home firewall. When I used Shareaza there was a place in the tools menu under connection options to enter the numbers. For instance, I had to tell Shareaza what my router's IP address was and what port to use for inbound requests. I told my firewall to allow that same address and port through. I forwarded that port through my router to my own computer (one of three in our home netword) and had many uploads right away. Where do I tell my Limewire software these things? Is it because I'm using the free version? :confused:


1. goto /tools/options/advance/firewalls
2. Click Force IP
3. Enter your Public IP address
4. If you are using a different Port: Number Enter it otherwise leave the default.

Hope this helps.

kathyathome January 3rd, 2003 02:42 PM

yes it does help, thanks
 
Duh, I saw the "advanced" but when I clicked on it nothing happened; double clicking opened it up to where I can see "firewall". thanks much. :rolleyes:

LeeWare January 3rd, 2003 09:41 PM

I hope things impove for you.

pokpok January 6th, 2003 12:24 PM

c'mon!
 
Lee, thank you! You really do crack me up! What a gas!!!! Do you work for Limewire by any chance. You certainly know alot of big words related to peer to peer. Ohhhhh!!! I forgot, you are Lee, the President of LeeWare.

Maybe you could ask the Vice President of LeeWare to research the issue unless of course she's in the the kitchen making a meat loaf.

Seriously Mr. President, please save your self gratifying posts for forums where people don't use their brains. You will defend Limewire no matter how poorly it performs.

Pokpok Sawsaw, The Filipino Genius of the Sawsaw clan.

LeeWare January 6th, 2003 09:02 PM

Re: c'mon!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by pokpok
Lee, thank you! You really do crack me up! What a gas!!!! Do you work for Limewire by any chance. You certainly know alot of big words related to peer to peer. Ohhhhh!!! I forgot, you are Lee, the President of LeeWare.

Maybe you could ask the Vice President of LeeWare to research the issue unless of course she's in the the kitchen making a meat loaf.

Seriously Mr. President, please save your self gratifying posts for forums where people don't use their brains. You will defend Limewire no matter how poorly it performs.

Pokpok Sawsaw, The Filipino Genius of the Sawsaw clan.

pokpok,

I see from your comments that you're a person that likes to talk just for the sake of hearing himself speak. I'm glad that you find my comments humorous, no, I do not work for Limewire and my comments are not politically motivated.

My comments merely reflect a more positive experience with the application-whereas your comments, appeared to be completely non-constructive. But hey, it's a public forum and you're free to express any opinion you like.

I don't like meat loaf-So, the "Vice president" is busy reading a book. I assume by your last comment regarding people not using their brains, you're talking about people on this forum.

It is interesting to me and I'm sure most of the people here that the best explanation for the problem you could come up with is, that the program "sucks."

Now, it would appear to me, and I can always be wrong-- that someone who holds this opinion of this application, especially when there are alternatives available wouldn't spend their time trolling the forum with such negativity.

But I guess it takes all types to make the world go-round and on this note, I'll leave the floor to you so that you can continue entertaining yourself.

Have fun!

MamiyaOtaru January 6th, 2003 09:36 PM

Quote:

How do you explain that Limewire achieves maybe 10-15% successful downloads when a PC running Kazaa sitting on the same desk, at the same time, searching the same Gnutella network
Kazaa does not connect to the Gnutella network, period. Perhaps that might shed a sliver of light on the difference in results. That is all.

sparkatus January 7th, 2003 01:52 AM

Same file being uploaded multiple times by same user
 
When I look at the library section that shows uploaded file with results like 98/99 or 1/2 or 0/2 and only rarely 1/1. When I observe the upload progress bar, it reaches 98% completiion only to disappear and then come back and progress to 98% completion again, over and over sometimes up to 98/98 times

Does this indicate that something is wrong on my side?

These are my particulars:
Limewire 2.7.13
AMD XP 1700+ 1 gig RAM
Windows XP SP1
Linksys Cable/DSL router
Port 6346 forwarded to my computer at 192.168.1.100
Forced Local IP (using my ip address, not 192.168.100)
DSL service 1500 kbs down/ 128 kbs up

JanusMantooth January 9th, 2003 07:10 PM

This is rediculous. This forum is based on a shoddy self help system. Endless posts about what people think is the reason for a problem and bad suggestions on how to fix it. Not one good answer from the developer. Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away, and I'm tired of reading back and forth posts which amount to nothing more than a "No, YOUR stupid!" argument.

It is undoubtable that limewire 2.8.5 is rediculously flawed. It is undoubtable that much more than a fraction of an improvement to the download errors can be obtained by the users. Limewire needs to do something about this. I would never register a program when they release versions as faulty as 2.8.5!

Bad form limewire. You still insist that people should download 2.8.5, even though it's very flawed. Why is that? If this is the result of beta testing, I'd hate to see that beta. With the recent lawsuits against p2p software, and bad luck, I can understand a rut, but you absolutely must do SOMETHING about this. At least post a reply letting us know that you are doing something to rectify 2.8.5!

Limehead dev guy February 10th, 2003 07:43 AM

response
 
You want a response to this inane drivel? How about this: you're all too stupid to use Limewire. Please uninstall the program immediately and subscribe to AOL.

That is all.

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 10:25 AM

All of you, wait for the next version, it comes with many, many exciting new features and maybe some new bugs to talk about. I'm a little bored by all this "Could not move to library","Can't upload", "Can't download" and "Can't connect" complaints. There is no solution for them at the moment and the LimeWire developers are aware of your complaints.

stief February 10th, 2003 12:11 PM

Thanks Trap_jaw: you've proven your right to speak by trying to help. Finally, someone with some credibility has said "it's a problem and will be fixed."

Please make this a sticky:
Quote:

"Could not move to library","Can't upload", "Can't download" and "Can't connect" complaints. There is no solution for them at the moment and the LimeWire developers are aware of your complaints.
Please also use your inside contacts to get Support to finally respond so we don't have to be told our ignorance (readily admitted) is stupidity. I noticed Sam was given a few bucks in appreciation of his work. You too, I hope.

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 12:23 PM

I doubt my "inside contacts" are really that good. I'm just reading the developer mailing lists.

stief February 10th, 2003 12:26 PM

Oh I see--you were being sarcastic when you said said the developers were aware and something is being done.

Silly me.

sberlin February 10th, 2003 12:47 PM

>Oh I see--you were being sarcastic when you said said the developers were aware and something is being done.

no he wasn't. the developers are aware, and are discussing problems on the development mailing lists, where contributers (like trap_jaw) are also active.

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by stief
Oh I see--you were being sarcastic when you said said the developers were aware and something is being done.

Silly me.

You misunderstood.

You said: "Please also use your inside contacts to get Support to finally respond so we don't have to be told our ignorance [...]"
I answered: "I doubt my 'inside contacts' are really that good." meaning that my contacts aren't good enough to get LimeWire's Support or the LimeWire developers to respond. They aren't really very communicative at the moment as you might have noticed.

stief February 10th, 2003 01:22 PM

Sorry Sam and trap_jaw--my mistake. I appreciate that you guys contribute solutions and generously try to help. Those like me who are users and want to share our files need to know where to look for solutions. I'd thought these forums were the place.

Should I be trying to read the developer mailing lists?
Should I watch here for a response from Limewire?

Thanks for any answer.

Respectfully--Stief.

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 03:43 PM

You are welcome to read it but I don't know if the posts will make much sense for you at first, unless you have some basic programming knowledge. But don't worry, I didn't have that either when I started reading it.

However I have to warn you, the dev mailinglists are not very exciting at all. If you are looking for all kinds of cool insider infos, it's probably not the right place to go.

Btw. I'm just about to write a weekly news flash about LimeWire development in the open discussion forum.

stief February 10th, 2003 03:56 PM

Thanks trap_jaw
http://www.limewire.org/project/www/MailingList.html is the place to start, I assume. Real info beats "cool insider" stuff anyday.

Angus February 10th, 2003 06:03 PM

Penumali kiki bobo (Greek to me)'ve'
 
You computer boys do run on so with that fancy jargon...

Had 2.7 - got music.

People came on with 2.8 and killed me dead.

I got 2.8 - don't get music.

Same computer, same server, same operator.

You've got problems.

See how easy that was.


Angus

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 06:46 PM

Quote:

Had 2.7 - got music.

People came on with 2.8 and killed me dead.

I got 2.8 - don't get music.

Same computer, same server, same operator.

You've got problems.
Actually you are the one having problems, because you are the one who cannot download any music. Unless you are able to describe your problem beyond "It doesn't work", it might very well stay your problem because I did not experience anything like that.

sberlin February 10th, 2003 06:58 PM

just fyi stief -- if you want to use the web archive to read any old stuff, don't be put off by the fact that it doesn't list any new posts after december. it's just a problem with the webserver that handles those pages (and the thing is too fragile to mess with), so just hit view all' [or whatever the actual link is] and scroll as needed.

Angus February 10th, 2003 07:24 PM

Not so sure...
 
Actually if you were just a bit less computer savy and more up on the english language, you would see that the problem came about for me with introduction of 2.8.6.

You know, the one you don't even use any more?

Read more, post less.

I am far from the only computer dullard that got up and going with the old version, no sweat, and have had the bottom fall out with this supposed upgrade.

I didn't pay for it, so who really cares - but others did.

They have begun posting too.

This is a shared network with shared problems.

If you want any of music, tough crap now because I get frustrated and quit far more frequently now.

"REQUERY" over and over and over and over...

It is our problem - but I obviously can do nothing to fix it except point out when it fails. (I write books for a living not programs.)

Later, much

Angus

stief February 10th, 2003 07:33 PM

back to sam
 
ah! Thanks sam. Luckily trap_jaw's summary here probably saved me hours of reading. I still plan to browse there more as time allows. Looks like "magnets" is the magic word for us on OSX. Now I have to find out what it means, and an OSX programmer!

BTW, I was reassured to see the Limewire team is active there--I was afraid the silence here since Christmas meant bad news for the company, and good news for those who would like to shut down these kinds of networks.

trap_jaw February 10th, 2003 08:02 PM

Re: Not so sure...
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Angus
Actually if you were just a bit less computer savy and more up on the english language, you would see that the problem came about for me with introduction of 2.8.6.
You know, the one you don't even use any more?
Read more, post less.
I am far from the only computer dullard that got up and going with the old version, no sweat, and have had the bottom fall out with this supposed upgrade.
I didn't pay for it, so who really cares - but others did.
They have begun posting too.
This is a shared network with shared problems.
If you want any of music, tough crap now because I get frustrated and quit far more frequently now.
"REQUERY" over and over and over and over...
It is our problem - but I obviously can do nothing to fix it except point out when it fails. (I write books for a living not programs.)

Later, much

Angus

I don't write programs for living either. If I had to, I'd probably starve. So if you want me (or one of the other open source developers - the LimeWire developers are already busy improving things) to help you, you have to be a little cooperative and give us a few bits of information like if you are seeing any error messages or what operating system you are using - maybe even give a short description of the problem.
This post tells me at least that your problem is related to the requery mode. I assume that most of your downloads go into requery mode without ever finishing. Okay. There is no quick fix for this (except for searching for that file again which might help occasionally), this issue is being addressed, wait for the next version since it will change the network topolgy to improve searches & downloads.

So long you could simply use another p2p client: There are eDonkey, DirectConnect and OpenNap clients for nearly every operating system (including MacOS). For windows there is also Kazaa and Piolet. Switch back to LimeWire when it has become better than the rest.

NoKaOi February 15th, 2003 04:09 PM

Commo check
 
This is a test to see if Force IP is working for me. Thank you!


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